Of expatriots, tourists and forums.

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[pongken]

....do hang around here for quite a while. Some interesting people contributed to this one.. Where are they now?

At first I could not figure out what BTF was, and then as I read more, I think I figured it out. Bali Travel Forum, Right? I guess that was "an issue" back in 2002.

The Western preoccupation with analysis and self-analysis is obvious in this thread. After being in Bali for a while, this analysis does get tedious. Has anyone else noticed that?

Ken

[JPB]

Yes - think it is called "navel gazing". It has been around with expats for at least 18 years that I know of - we live here and know it all - rather than making contact with the tourist who has nothing to offer my ego.
Some of us tourists have been coming regularly and helping the economy greatly - we can't all of us give up our day jobs to follow the rainbow. And we don't all stay in Kuta and drink ourselves silly or stay in Sanur and not spend any money.

Bert's blog gave an insight to day to day living - where are you Bert - hasn't the novelty worn off yet!!

Have been following Nick on Baliblog who does give a day to day plus photos although all of the West side. His trips up and round country are interesting.

hopefully the posters in this thread will come back.

cheers
Juliette

PS Don't forget Bert -

[Roy]

Dunno Juliette, but maybe I sense in you a little jealousy? Not able to “chase your rainbow?” Why not? The day job has you by the…ah, well anyway.

Really sorry, I am, if I’ve hit some sensitive cords, but you know what? We’ve all had them hit really hard. Every surviving expat I know has passed the gauntlet of life on Bali.

It’s not an ego thing that defines the difference of an expat from a tourist. It’s commitment, resolve, and a love of our new home. We work as hard at this as tourists work at home in their cubicles or offices, prisoners of a world that leaving it, only brings on incalculable fear.

You, and others like you, come and go like the tide, ebb and flow, but there is no real commitment, nor is there any passion. I’m totally unimpressed.

"Navel gazing" is NOT a pastime for us expats. By that, I of course mean, not our own navels anyway! :lol:

[Sparky]

As much as i admire people who have 'taken the plunge' and moved lock stock and barrell to their paradise risks, worries and all, i also think that there is also a certain 'them and us' way of life when it comes to ex-pats and tourists anywhere in the world. I have been to certain places where the ex-pats think that they have a divine right to everything and that the tourist is nothing but a nuisance who is invading their space. This aspect of ex-pat snoberry always irritates me when it pops its ugly head up :evil:

Regs Mark

[drdana]

wow py i have just read your reply about the them and us of ex pats and tourists, and read through the forum.

my problem is i do not feel as if this place is "paradise" and what gets boring are all the people who seem to walk around blinded by rose colored glasses. When tourists gush at me about what is it LIKE living here in this paradise...I say: Hmmmm. I think I would rather be a tourist like you than live here. And ... which paradise would you be speaking about?

But it is true that tourists just wanna have fun....and some get captured by a Bali Fever that: in the case of one woman who sold everything she has in Milwaukee, and came here to have a son with no father yet have a baby ceremony...Her eyes close in dreaminess as I listen to her inanely saying something about "Everyone's reality is different." And she insists on walking around publicly here in Bali, her dreamland, with no underwear on, and stark naked....And this leaves me wondering: well: where is her respect for the culture she is so enamoured of? Does she even think about where she is living, and how many Balinese women or men for that matter walk around publicly with no clothes?

This "tourist" soon to be expat I might add is actually only a hunk of meat the dutch daughter in law has dragged home for the family to feed from, but I wish her sweet dreams may they last forever, because waking up is going to be painful.

But Roy has a point: ANYONE who has lived here for any length of time has gone down the gauntlet, and knows what happens in real life.

Unfortunately I have to deal with tourist issues every day and I get so utterly bored at times. But I cannot help but feel bad for the Milkcows on this island who are milk and madu and might someday wake up to a different reality, which is REAL.

[Roy]

Without question, we all miss Py. I wish I was at liberty to disclose who he is, but that would be a violation of the first rule of conduct among expats. If you knew his name, and googled him, you'd get some 4 or so pages, (20 sites a page), but in reality, that doesn't mean much to him, nor should it to us.

Sparky wrote of "expat snobbery." I don't see it that way, and it's been my pleasure to personally host several of Bert’s forum members here in Bali, who post here regularly. I don't think any of them considered me a snob, but then again, who knows?

Protectionists....now that's something I think all of us expats could be called. But that is understandable, or at least, it is to me.

Waking up to a different reality? I can see that for some folks. I've always said about Bali, "many are called, but few are chosen." Another of my favorite lines about expats is that they "ebb and flow like the tide."

The fact is, Bali is not for everyone to call home. For those that call Bali home...they are no more special than one who calls anywhere else on earth home.

[Thorsten]

Py brought me to this forum, when it was once started, never dreamed to join an expat forum, why should I?
What could I share with an expat on Bali, what could be of any interest for an expat on Bali, that I could contribute, why should I bother them?
Py came over with this thesis, that it’s insignificant where somebody is physically present, he meant the willingness and the ability to get another perspective, apart from our daily, well known environment would lead to a crossover, an exchange of different positions regarding many things, by this we would absorb a little of everything and so we would all become a kind of expat anywhere.
(I know, this might sound strange and it took me some time to understand this, don’t wane bother you with an essay for further explanation).

For me personally, I’m glad to have joined this forum, I have met a lot of very interesting people here on this forum, I got to know a different perspective due many things, I had myself and I have monitored some very interesting discussions here, I have learned something here.
I consider this as enrichment and during the time, I have sometimes changed my personal view on the one or other thing, the crossover works ;-)

There was a time, I had also some private conversations with Py, of course I know who and what he is, but my admiration for him has nothing to do with his work, although it’s impressing.
I miss him, his sharp intellect, the ability to get the things exactly to the point, to analyse, to describe (he is also a painter with words).

When I will return to Bali in December/January, I hope to meet and get to know some people of this forum personally, don’t know if you are still in contact with him Roy, but maybe there’s a chance to have the one or other drink together at Nuri’s?

Best regards
Thorsten

[Bert Vierstra]

Py sneaks in sometimes, he reads.

[jill]

well this is very interesting subject . starting with who should read what :shock: no one has that right ?

as for expats being snobs :shock: ???? all my mate's in bali are expats not one snob .
they are all to busy with life

But may be what was ment there ... that some times you for get you to where once a big eyed tourist ha ...

as for the LUCKY ones that got to follow there rainbow ... well if you want something go do it , dont make excuse's we are only what we let our self's be

go roy keep checking out the navel's ... just don't get cought :lol: