Thread: Check the access to your land and beware of passive/active ADAT

Hi,
The main problem is the way some Balinese want to treat us with a shocking discrimination. It is an offense to the human rights of every being and I feel like my responsibility here is to let them know there are some limits, especially when they have no legal power. This is an offense to the adat Bali and make the whole Balinese community look bad. I appreciate them and can t let this happen.

Dear Dedoo and Robin,
Thanks for your support. I don t want to name the place in detail because this might affect the reputation of their whole community and except for the 5 people i spoke about, so far, they do not deserve this.
I m in, Robin, if you have a meeting, let us know.
If someone like a girl, it doesn t give him the right to rape her. If you like a car, it doesn t give you the right to steal it. Eventhough the girl is beautiful and the owner of that car the richest man on the planet.

Hmmmm... What a sad state of affairs. Unfortunately this happens far too often and it's disgusting how regularly they get away with it.

The statement that it's only recently Balinese behave like this is so untrue. Throughout the years it's well known there can be a very nasty underlying character to some local Balinese people, whether it stems from greed or jealousy who knows. If you think it's isolated to foreigners you'd be wrong, and yes the Balinese do, very ignorantly, count non Balinese Indonesians as foreigners too. The fact is the ones with this character fault will generally behave that way to whoever, neighbours, family members, etc, it's just foreigners tend to speak more openly about it.

The fact is Desa Adat and it's organisation in general has in many areas developed into a group of individuals that lack any understanding of other people's beliefs and rights to live in peace. It's either their outdated ideals and enforcement of made up unreasonable rules that you have to agree to or you are branded a Bali hater and told to "go back to your own country", then threatened with death or house burning. At the heart of things they are really cowards that only act out in groups by extorting and threatening good people.

The suggestion Robin makes sounds sensible on the surface of things, getting a group of the other property owners may have a better affect when negotiating with the lowly characters. But be sure, even if things seem to go well with new negotiation, they can always harbour vindictive hateful feelings, so it may turn out to be a long term problem.

It's so frustrating having to deal with these types of things and it's very sad such people are allowed to operate with such impunity, and it's terrible in many of these same situation the police are either powerless (by choice) or themselves afraid to go against the Deas Adat.

P.S. A note to anyone interested in buying land in Bali. Please double and triple check the access to your land. It's actually against the law to sell land without access, but that means nothing. It's always the safest bet to have the road access on your certificate. Never ever rely on informal agreements, with neighbouring land owners to give right of access through their property!

Liesna it might be best to discuss this in private. You can write to me at Desarna@gmail.com if you want.

This is up to you but I might be able to help you.

Dear Pete,

I have checked the access as well in the BPN and discussed that with the Kelian adat and Dinas before. There were no more hidding cost to pat they said...except a usual pemopog that they couldn t calculate before we build a house....All of a sudden, the calculation came clear a month after we started to build and it became urgent to pay if we wish to continue.
The kepala desa already signed the IMB and before him the Kelian Dinas and Kelian Adat.
Sooooooo disgusting, they do believe it is a `normal` behavior telling me us is cheap!!!! in the next village they would charge you 20 000 euros as a welcome fee . Beautiful island isn t it ?

PeteD

Thanks for the input, yes a sad state of affairs and also to hear that this is indeed not a new problem. The concern as you rightly say is that the problem will fester if we reach a favourable conclusion
and it is something we have all discussed, so we are very aware with what we are doing and tread carefully.

Indeed since the problem has arisen there have been a spate of burglaries, whether its by local people is not known as they have not been caught........the police are useless and also the properties security who are local Balinese which tells you something. All the burglaries have been carried out by groups of around 10 people so you stand no chance, its like a terror campaign to force you to pay up or force you out.. The latter may be what eventually happens, sell up and get out.

With our access problem we found out that access rights were granted in 2002 and there is legal paperwork to prove it, but this seems to stand for nothing with the locals............just a bunch who are a law to them selves and legal agreements stand for nothing. As you say the police dont want to get involved and the local leader was not happy when they were called the first time the access was blocked.

Its sad they behave like this and how they treat foriegners and indonesians, the latter I can only summise is because the central government is in Jakarta, whether its religous, cultural or historical I don't know as I don't know enough about the background. But you find similar problems in other parts of Indonesia.
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Originally Posted by tintin

Liesna, pollyanna, Robin,

Sorry, Peter, but I TOTALLY disagree with you: Liesna, polloyanna, and Robin are NOT part of the "community," and never will be. What kind of "community" is this anyway? It's sounds to me more like a bunch of extortionists. Who, in his/her right mind would want to live in the midth of such a "friendly" community and be proud of it?

PS. PeterD is right: this is certainly NOT a new phenomenon. Since my firts time in Bali, in 1984, I have heard and had personally some close calls myself when I decided to get involved in a Balinese "community."

Tintin, I have probably miscommunicated. Our village is absolutely lovely. They have been fair and reasonable. There was only one man who tried to get money for a road he didn't own, not our village. And the woman who wanted money for right-of-way or access truly does own the land the road is on. We were happy to pay.
Our friend and nominee has been invaluable in showing us how things work and in acting as the communicator between us and the village. When we first found the land Wayan said the first thing we had to do was meet with the village elders, find out their expectations, and become a part of the community. That is what we have done and continue to do.
Today we have our purification ceremony for the land and the village priest will be one of two priests involved in the ceremony. The village leader will also be there.
Hopefully things will continue in this way and we will be a part of the community for the rest of our lives. We love our village and the Balinese people.